Respond to the questions at the end of the case, but do so:
* last name A-M from a utilitarian point of view
* last name N-Z from a virtue ethics point of view.
Then respond to a classmates' post in the opposite theory. In other words, if you posted as a utilitarian, respond to someone who responded as a virtue ethicist.
The difference in this case study between a physician-patient or dentist-patient relationship is that physicians are hired by hospitals larger institutions that they must answer too. A dentist at least my experience with dentist is that they own their own practices so the care they decide to give they do not have to answer to anyone about the care they decide to provide or not provide to a patient. The dentist in a utilitarian perspective should perform the procedure because it is beneficial to the dentist for the sum of money that the dentist will receive and it will be beneficial for the patient because he gets want he wants. However if i was in that situation i would go against the utilitarian point of view because this patient is not in his sound mind to have this procedure. His ideas about destroying society and trying to prevent a toothache that the dentist believes is not needed.
ReplyDeleteThat's a different perspective on Dentist-Patient and Physician-Patient relationships that I haven't thought about, and I like where you went with that idea. For a Utilitarian point of view, however, if we were maximizing that good and minimizing the harm that would be experienced by both parties, then wouldn't it make sense to not perform the operation either way you slice it? The Endodontist would be fine either way, either gaining money or being able to keep a clean conscious. The patient, however, would be damaging his teeth on purpose, which would not be minimizing harm due to the possible complications that come with having roughly 20+ root canals done. Also, if the patient didn't get the procedure that he wanted, the Endodontist would've successfully prevented harm to his patient for the current time being. There is only one decision that would minimize harm for the patient, and that's why I think that either way, the operation cannot be performed under utilitarian thinking.
DeleteFrom an Ethics Virtue role though, one would not perform the procedure. This is based on the fact that if the doctor thinks it is unethical to extract teeth and perform a root canal on a patient that isn't in need for one. Even though that is what the patient wants, it would not be the right thing to do.
DeleteIt's hard to always perform what the patient wants. Being put in the situation where you have to perform something you don't want to is hard as well. There is no need for the root canal and I think that is very important in him making his decision.
DeleteIn general, there is no difference between dentist- patient and a physician patient relationship. Both the physician and the dentist are there to provide a service for the patient. Both the physician and the dentist are educated in their fields of practice and are capable of making good, rational decisions to promote overall health of the patient.
ReplyDeleteFrom a virtue ethics perspective, the dentist doesn't feel that it is ethical to remove healthy teeth from Patrick M's mouth. The dentist understands why Patrick M wants the teeth to be removed but it doesn't make sense to potentially harm Patrick M with an elective surgery in which possible complications can occur and leave Patrick M sicker. I believe that the dentist is acting virtuously but not removing Patrick M's health teeth.
Lauren,
DeleteI agree that there no real difference in the realtionship with the patient btween and doctor and a dentsit. However, i think you should consider the fact that dentist, in general, usually own their own practices and therefore have more freedom to make their own decision becasue they make their own policies, unlike a docotr who has to answer to the organization they work for.
I think that the Virture Ethics person would not say either choice is right or wrong becasue it is not the option that is right ot wrong, but the person who makes the choice is right or wrong. Virtue ethics is about the character of the person making the decision, not about the rightness or wrongness of a choice. Therefore, i hink the virtue thics would vary on which choice was good or bad. Virtue theics would say that if the dentist was a person of good moral character then they will make the right choice, whatever it may be. Ad they would say that of the dentist is of poor moral character, then the decsion they make will be bad.
I agree more with the virtue ethical side of the argument. I don't think that the root canal in not ethical. the doctor should understand why Patrick wants his tooth removed, yes possible complications can occur, but it would ultimately be Patrick's decision on what to do.
DeleteIn theroy, there is no difference in the relationship between a dentist and a patient and a doctor and a patient. However a dentist does have more freedom to do what they want becasue usually, a dentist owns his own clinic while doctors usually are a part of an organization.
ReplyDeleteI think that accroding to the utilitarian point of view that the dentist would not do the total root canal. Utilitarianism is all about maximizing good and minimizing harm. Pain is harm. I think that the Utilitarianists would say that because the surgery would cause so much pain and hrm and has some very serious complications that Patrick should not get the procedure. There is also the fact that Patrick has healthy teeth and has not had any past problems with his teeth and is unlikely to have a problem with his teeth the Utilitarinist would say that there is no benefit for the patient to get this and that it would only casue harm/pain to the patient, so the procedur should not be done.
Tonya,
DeleteI agree with you. By maximizing the good and reducing the harm, the doctor would be acting as a Utilitarian. The patient presents with a clear and health dental history and so these elective surgeries would cause bodily harm. As I read your post and thought more about it, I began to think about not only physical heath status but mental and emotional status. These both play a pivotal in what makes a person ultimately happy. I am having a hard time deciding if the harm the patient would undego to have these elective procedures out weigh the joy and satisfaction it would bring him, thereby maximizing his personal good, putting additional money Into the doctors pockets. This is tricky and I am probably grabbing at straws but I just thought depending on how you look at it, there might be a alternative way to think about it.
Any medical professional who has achieved the level of doctor deserves the same about of respect as those who actually practice more common medicine. The type of doctor in this case is not important. What is important however, is the elective procedure that the patient is attempting to undergo. The "apocalypse is coming" mentality is seen as crazy until something horrible happens and that person in the only one prepared. So in that case, stock up on a few cases of water, some extra batteries and blanket. Not remove your perfectly healthy teeth for fear that they may at some point cause pain.
ReplyDeleteFrom the Virtue ethics POV, the doctor acting out of sound mind and judgment shouldn't conduct the elective procedure based solely on damaging the healthy tissue surrounding the patients teeth. Furthermore this actions goes against principles of rationality and is just down right silly.
I completely agree when you say that this goes against the principles of rationality. I liked the alternate choice that you gave the Doomsday patient; rather than root canals, just stock up on some batteries and blankets! If we're going by his rationale, then why don't we just laser-remove all of our hair for fear of an ingrown follicle? This kind of preparation makes no sense virtuously for the Endodontist, so I agree that he his acting out of sound mind and judgement.
DeleteIn my opinion, a Dentist-Patient relationship is not as intimate as a Physician-Patient relationship. A Dentist need not know, for example, if you have arthritis or if you have knee pain, the Dentist only needs to know your dental history. A Physician, conversely, needs to know all about your medical history in order to make informed, beneficial decisions regarding your health and welfare. Having said this, I feel like the difference isn't significant between the Dentist- and Physician-Patient relationships because both require a kind of privacy and trust.
ReplyDeleteFrom a Virtue Ethics stand point, I think that the Endodontist, if acting with his virtues in mind, shouldn't operate on this specific patient. The patient has an intriguing reason behind wanting the procedure, but the Endodontist cannot, with a sound argument, perform this operation. The Endodontist would be purposefully damaging the "excellent overall health of the teeth" for a situation that nothing currently indicates will happen. In his professional, medically-informed opinion, while keeping his virtues paramount, the Endodontist cannot operate because he wouldn't be helping the patient in any way that would currently be beneficial. The procedure would be completed on the grounds of a hypothetical situation, so the Endodontist is correct when he questions whether or not to remove healthy tissue.
Vic,
DeleteI agree with what you said about the dentist-patient relationship not being as intimate as the physician-patient relationship. Also what you said about both requiring a kind of privacy and trust.
Also I agree that if the endodontist is acting on his virtues that he shouldn't operate on this patient. I also agree with what you said about the endodontist damaging the "excellent overall health of the teeth" to avoid a situation that might not even happen.
I like your thought process on the difference between the patient relationships with physician versus a dentist. I think physicians most likely deal with a more vast amount of patient health issues, where as dentists deal with teeth. I think you made a lot of great points in terms of a virtue standpoint also. I agree that the Endodontist wouldn't perform the procedure because it would be damaging healthy tissue for an unnecessary reason at that current time.
DeleteIn a utilitarian view, I do not believe there is a significant difference between a physician and dentist-patient relationship. Although dentists don't know as much information about a person as a physician might, dentists still have access to very confidential information such as insurance, social security number, address, etc. The endodontist should not proceed with Patrick's request. It would be causing Patrick much harm that he does not have to go through. Root canals are often very painful. Removing the healthy blood vessels and nerves in his teeth would cost Patrick very much. The procedure is also very expensive. The cost of this would cause more harm than benefit.
ReplyDeleteI do not believe there is a significant difference between physician-patient relationships and that of dentist-patient relationships. Both of these being in their chosen profession has made a promise to do whatever is best for their patients, to do good and cause no harm, while putting their judgement and opinions aside.
ReplyDeleteAfter reading this case and looking at it from a Utilitarian point of view, I came to the decision that the endodontist should decline in carrying out the root canal procedure for Patrick. A Utilitarian would do whatever it takes to maximize the good in a situation and to minimize the bad. By declining to take Patrick as a patient, you are saving him from the pain a root canal brings, and the amount of money he would have to spend to get the procedure complete. The endodontist would have to inform Patrick that they only perform such procedures on patients in need of one and his wanting to get a root canal done to try and decrease later damage would not be a good enough reason. Some people go their whole lives without getting a root canal done and if it is not necessary, he is not going to cause Patrick harm to his teeth or his bank account without reason.
I do not believe there is a difference between physician-patient relationships and dentist-patient relationships, both provide care for a patient. Although dentists usually have their own practice, while most physicians are part of a larger organization working with other physicians in the same field.
ReplyDeleteFrom a utilitarian point of view, I do not believe the root canal should be performed. A utilitarian wants to maximize the good while minimizing the bad in a situation. If the procedure is not done, then Patrick saves a lot of money and does not have to go through the pain in which a root canal causes. There is a lot more bad that will come from performing the procedure than not performing the procedure.
I do not think that there is a differentce between the physician-patient relationship and the dentist-patient relationship. Both provide care for patients, and both have similar interactions with their patients. If i were to look at this case from a utilitarian point of view i would have to say that the root canal should not be done. From a utilitarian perspective i would want to maximize the good while minimizing the bad in the situation. If the physician chooses not to go through with the procedure, Patrick would save his money, and would not have to go through the pain that he would've received from the root canal. The bad of the situation would be that he is still going to have severe tooth pain.
ReplyDeleteIn my opinion, physician-patient and dentist-patient relationships are extremely similar in that that both physicians and dentists provide health care and advice for patients. However, I think physicians deal with more patients that have potentially serious and possibly life threatening issues.
ReplyDeleteAccording to a utilitarian point of view, I believe that the morally right decision would be for the patient not to go through with the root canals. The utilitarian theory states that the best decision is minimizing harm while maximizing good. The patient going through such a drastic procedure would cause a lot of pain and a long recovery, which he could avoid because he doesn't currently have a need for it and may never need it.
I believe the that the doctor/patient and dentist/patient relationship are very similar. Each medical professional has duties to provide he best patient care possible for each patient; furthermore, each often take a version o the Hippocratic Oath. The setting in which they practice does not change this act. Even if they practice in a private clinic, the must still answer to boards when dealing with potentially harmful treatment.
ReplyDeleteFrom the utilitarian perspective, the dentist must act in a way that he treats humanity never simply as a mean, but also at the same time as an end. The only logical way the doctor would perform the surgery is or monetary gain. The unnecessary surgery has more potentially devastating consequences or the patient than potential benefits. Thus, the dentist would not be maximizing good or minimizing harm if the root canals are performed.
The utilitarian point of view wants to minimize the hard that could be done from performing the root canal. He has perfect teeth and that is maximizing the good. Which is also a part of the point of view. Dentist and physicians both face issues that they may not want to perform. They deal with different severity of cases however.
ReplyDeleteI see no ethical distinction between a doctor and a dentist. Obviously there are extreme differences in the scope of their work and practice, but morally speaking, they are both obligated to use their expertise to care for their patients. It is difficult to apply utilitarianism to this situation because the assumptions of utilitarianism have broken down. It is fulfilling the patient's wishes to perform the root canal, but this is a highly unreasonable request and it is almost destined to do more harm than good. The problem is that utilitarianism can rest on different definitions of benefit. Does benefit mean satisfying wishes, or does it mean contributing to the well-being of people? There are many times when what we want is not really good for us, and this is surely one of them. I believe that most utilitarian would say that performing the root canal would not really bring the greatest good to the greatest number. Of course, I would expect there to be hardliners who disagree, but it is hard to make the case that fulfilling the patient's wishes would maximize the good in society
ReplyDeleteThere is really no difference in dentist-patient and a physician-patient relationship. Both the physicians and the dentist provide services for the patient. Both are educated and able to make a good rational decisions to promote the health of the patient.
ReplyDeleteFrom the virtue ethics perspective, the dentist wouldn't feel that it is ethical to remove any healthy teeth from Patrick's mouth. The dentist understands that Patrick wants his teeth to be removed but acting virtuously the potential harm inflicted on a patient for unnecessary means doesn't make sense. I dont think that the dentist would elect to remove any of his teeth.
There is no difference between the relationships of dentist and physicians with their patients. Both of these professionals are to provide honest, confidential care to these patients, with their best judgement and intentions in mind. Also, both relationship are based on trust of these professionals, which is built based on the same sort of therapeutic communication and interaction. Based on a virtue ethical perspective, the endodontist would not perform the root canals on the perfectly healthy teeth. Patrick's teeth are intact and there is not a legitimate reason for surgical interventions to be implemented. The appropriate rationale would have to be present for any surgical procedure to be performed and this bizarre case is no exception.This endodontist feels this would be an unethical procedure if he were to remove healthy tissue overall making his decision based on his ethics. Through education and clinical experience, this endodontist has developed morals and ethics to base his practice from, and to me, this would make these sorts of situations simple to handle.
ReplyDelete